E85 Hitting L.A. at 85 Cents a Gallon

Don’t get too excited, Los Angelinos. GM is footing the bill to promote the first gas station in Los Angeles to sell E85. The company says there are about 46,000 flex-fuel vehicles in the area that could take advantage of the station. If you drive one of them, you can check out ConservFuel in Brentwood between noon and 2 p.m. Feb. 26 to get your 85-cent-a-gallon E85.

Comments

[Dan Mc]

Cars.com visitors please note e85prices.com which lists the price of e85 at stations across the United States including this new Consev Station in LA

A few things to consider about E85.

1.Yes.. you will get lower mpg's..generally in the 10-20% range. That is why it is essential the Stations keep E85 priced at least in that discount range.

2. The loss of MPGs is two fold, one- ethanol has slightly less energy content than gasoline and two- the flex fuel vehicles are optimised (tuned) for gasoline not ethnaol.

3.There is very little difference between a non flex and flex fuel vehicle. Usually simply the engine tune and occassionally the fuel injectors are slight larger. That is why it only cost the auto manufacturer around $150 to make a non-flex into a flex fuel vehicle.

4.E85 is around 105 octane ! Excellent fuel that burns clean and provides increase in horsepower. Racing fuel is $6 a gallon and that is why you see racers moving over to e85.

[Dan]

Whoa there Dan MC, careful.
Point #3. There is considerably more difference between a non flex and a flex fuel vehicle than an engine tuning and some fuel injectors. E85 is considerably more corrosive to many metal and rubber components than regular gasoline (or even E10). Therefore most of the fuel system pieces need to be replaced with stainless steel and different plastics. I can't just take my car and put in bigger injectors and adjust the timing then run E85. Well, I guess I could, but I couldn't for very long.
You're right, it isn't a big difference in price at the manufacturers end. But, there are alot of cheap "E85 conversion" kits out there that don't do the total job, and people need to beware of them.

[George]

Naturally aspirated engine can never be 'optimized' for ethanol fuels without compromising their ability to work with gasoline.

If you took the compression ratio WAY up to 15:1 and utilized direct injection with 100% ethanol, it would never function on gasoline.

Right now, gasoline direct injection gives the consumer all the potential benefits of ethanol fuels E70-E85, without any compromises.
Look at Audi's 3.1 V6, it has a 12.5:1 compression ratio, and it works just fine on European 95RON fuel (90AKI)

Also look at VW's 2.0T, over 10:1 compression ratio AND a turbocharger.

If we are going to be stuck with 10% ethanol in our gasoline, the least that can be done is an increase in the AKI of the fuel.
87,89,91 just doesn't cut it.
87, 90, 93 should be the minimum if 10% ethanol is added. (you want to get something for the 3+% reduction in mileage)