Hybrids Not as Environmentally Friendly as Thought

A study by an Oregon automotive research company details vehicles’ energy costs per mile — from inception through production right to your garage. The results are surprising and could put a damper on environmentalists’ support of hybrids. Because the study takes into account every aspect of the production process, hybrids like the Honda Accord Hybrid have an energy cost of $3.49 per mile. Compare that to a regular Accord, at $2.18, or a Hummer H3, at $1.98, and that green vehicle taxes the environment more.

The study has actually been out for some time, but we hadn’t read it before and thought it might spark an interesting discussion.

Now, these results don’t impact mileage at all. Buyers looking to save at the pump get better mileage with efficient hybrids. This study simply highlights the hidden environmental impacts of these new technologies — mainly the additional batteries and electric motors a hybrid requires. Of course, over time — with more research and development — the environmental impact should decrease. For now, though, don’t be so quick to frown at the Hummer H3 driver next to you at the stoplight.

[Look Beyond Gas Mileage When Making an Environmental Choice, 37signals.com]

Comments

I wonder how a diesel would compare with a hybrid?
See http://www.aa1car.com/library/diesel_vs_hybrids.htm
for my take on the subject.

This study is hogwash.

First of all, it considers the life of a Prius at only 100,000 miles, but the Hummer gets a life of 300,000 miles. That alone invalidates the data.

The conclusions appear to be very different from the results of several other rigorous, scientifically-reviewed studies of the lifecycle impact of vehicles (e.g. Argonne National Laboratory, Massachusetts Institute of Technology).

· Example 1: These studies conclude that the majority (80-85%) of the total lifetime energy use of a vehicle comes from the driving stage, with the remainder coming from the remaining stages of a vehicle life, whereas the CNW study shows these percentages to be reversed.

· Example 2: Two Toyota models mentioned in the report, the Scion xA and xB sold only in the USA, are engineered with the same processes, built on the same assembly line, transported and shipped together, distributed through the same dealer network, have the same engines and transmissions, are about the same weight (within 50 lbs.), and have very similar fuel consumption ratings (one just over 35 mpg combined, the other just below 35), yet the CNW study shows the lifetime energy use of these vehicles to be very different (53 per cent).

· Example 3: The CNW study states that hybrids require more lifetime energy than even large SUVs. Toyota’s internal analysis does conclude that there is more energy required in the materials production stage for a hybrid, but that this is overwhelmingly made up for in the driving stage (the 80-85% stage), causing the hybrid to have a significantly lower lifetime energy use.

There are also basic factual errors in the report, for example CNW claim that the hybrid batteries are not recycled.

In truth Toyota and sister brand Lexus have a comprehensive battery recycling programme in place and has been recycling Nickel-Metal Hydride (NiMH) batteries since the RAV4 Electric Vehicle was introduced in 1998. Every part of the battery, from the precious metals to the plastic, plates, steel case, and the wiring, is recycled. To ensure that batteries come back to Toyota, each battery has a phone number on it to call for recycling information.

Toyota and other environmentally conscious car makers have been using life cycle assessment for many years to evaluate various advanced vehicle technologies. Toyota, along with many others, believes that the best way to judge the environmental impact of a vehicle is to do a full evaluation of all the inputs and outputs in every stage of its life. The lifetime energy use is just one of the many things to look at.

The environment and the role of the car in CO2 emissions are rightly a very important subject for debate. Toyota welcomes such debate. However, the debate is not helped by sensationalistic reporting of an uncorroborated and unrepresentative piece of marketing research carried out in North America.

Believe anything in this study at your peril.

Hybrids are the future. This is a study commissioned by the Big Three automakers to discredit hybrids because their hybrid offerings are extremely weak. They don't want you to know that only Toyota is doing things to save the environment.

You're so wrong Toyota Troll. If I wanted to buy one of the most uninteresting cars on earth I'd go look at Toyota.

Anyone hear of fuel-cells? How about the recently announced car that runs on hydrogen (oh wow, ZERO emissions instead of ultra-low)? Clean-Diesel technology? I think other car companies, with greater research capabilities and advancements in other areas, will definately give hybrids an early death. Interest is already waning....

How to you measure energy costs in $? It would be more interesting to do this study in Europe where gas is priced to reflect its cost to society. There lower mileage would aid hybrids more

A H3 has lower energy costs per mile than a Accord??? How do you get that result. The Hummer is more expensive, heavier and gets significantly worse MPG. So this boggles my mind.

"oyota Troll. If I wanted to buy one of the most uninteresting cars on earth I'd go look at Toyota."

yep, thats why Toyotas are flying off dealer lots and market share is increasing fast. Come on.....

Is the FJ Cruiser uninteresting? Scion xB? New Camry (compared to 500 or Malibu or Impala)? Uninteresting or not the cars sell and fast.

You are right about the future though. Hybrids are a stepping stone to fuel-cells and hydrogen. but this is far out in the future. Meanwhile clean diesels are probably the most promising short term.

And the future would come a lot sooner if the US raised gas taxes to levels that reflect the true cost of buying gas to society.

I disagree. So what if it costs more. That's why they aint polluting a lot like a Hummer or other cars that are lame when it comes to pollution. I hope someone already bans diesels. Asthma causers!!!

If you truly want to help the environment, stop driving, Troll. You seem to be such an advocate of higher fuel prices. This boggles MY mind.

Yes, the Xb is uninteresting - to answer your posted question. A Camry is a good car, but about as "interesting" as a Math quiz.

How in the world can anyone ASK for higher taxes? I certainly can't afford MORE taxes. What would that extra revenue be spent on? I don't trust the government to use the money wisely to develop clean alternative energy sources for automobiles or improved highways. Any higher fuel taxes would likely be wasted on pork-barrel projects with no real benefit to the people who paid for them. I'm all for improved hybrids, clean diesels, fuel cells, etc., but I believe public interest will drive demand and encourage business and industry to develop them. I don't believe the government can use fuel tax money to force the issue.

It's always interesting to see how many comments are required in a particular string before the debate devolves into unnecessary and inflammatory adjectives, broad generalizations, personal opinions, and insults. It also appears to be very seductive to attempt discredit painstaking and comprehensive studies with a few simple calculations, becuase I've noted this in other blogs.

It is to the credit of Toyota marketing personnel that in public discourse the company is perceived as the only manufacturer leading the way in efforts to improve fuel economy, and seldom is Honda cited, when in fact ALL of Hondas offerings are near the top or even lead their respective category, hybrid or not. Otherwise acceptable designs get "turned back" for more work to improve this by the people at the highest levels of the company. The emphasis on fuel economy dates all the way back to the introduction of the Honda CVCC hatchback, from which the Honda Civic name was derived.

This may sound naive, but it sounds like the study is really based on actual amount of energy used in the manufacturing process, i.e. number of BTU's per pound of car produced. The nature of hybrids requires that they roll out of the factory with a built-in energy source (the batteries). Non-hybrids come off of the assembly line with, what, 5 gallons of gas? My guess is that producing a technologically advanced energy delivery and recovery system such as that used in hybrids requires more BTU's than simply cracking crude oil and building a time-tested internal combustion engine. Fossil fuels are produced by more or less boiling crude, while hybrid systems require the added energy of refining precious metals and producing the compounds and chemicals needed for energy-dense batteries, not to mention relatively complex control systems required to marry the internal combustion engine with the electric motor/charging system.

Larry S.S. - very interesting post. I agree that the examples cited invalidate the conclusions.

Besides, I'd rather see a road full of Priuses and Accords than Hummers any day.

The study is great! There is a great article on www.omnivalves.com about hybrids, the bottom line is that saving money is saving the environment! The most precious resource is the resource that turn in to any natural resource and that is MONEY!

That web site www.omnivalves.com they have the answer to the problem of pollution and that is to make the gas and diesel engine much more efficient and they do in a very simple and very cheap way. With an intake valve. Really cool stuff, check it out, it makes sense that the simple way is always preferred!

Hybrids Not Completely Eco-Friendly.

They are not going to produce them for the US market in 07.

There are totally environmentally friendly cars and car oil?
http://www.sinosells.com/?u=1221

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